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Hummer H2For those who like a little more gleam to their Hummer, the H2 offers a similar rugged look as the H1, but as a lower cost, and with more added features, making it almost a massive luxury SUV.
Tell me you did not do all this to install LED lights in the doors.
LED lights are notorious for causing electrical gremlins on the H2.
If that was the reason for pulling off all 4 door panels, but the old bulbs back and see if that puts everything back to normal.
- finall, no i didnt put LED lights in, but that is good info to know. Then again, everything is notorious for causing electrical gremlins in the H2. As long as I have owned H2s that has always been its Achilles heel. Given, I was thinking about doing some kind of upgrade eventually... so with this new info, what do you suggest to get the LED bright light inside, without the statred complications of the LED light
Originally Posted by oceanbrave
To check the DDM connectors there is no need to remove the door panel, it can be popped-out with some plastic panel levers.
As you mirrors are working there MUST BE +12V power on the DDM, also as they are operated by the DDM's Microcontroller so it shows the electronics is working. The mirrors are pretty much wired to connector C4 (10-Way Black)
All the LED and Switches are controlled via serial-data from the Microcontroller so again all this must be also working.
Looking at the wiring diagram and DDM circuit diagram, I see that the Courtesy Lamp power comes from Connector C2 Pin 13 (Dark Blue + White wire) and on the PCB is controlled by the Microcontroller which also monitors the Courtesy voltage and current!
It could be the Courtesy Lamp circuit is either drawing too much current, or not enough current, so the Microcontroller has gone into some kind of shutdown (there may be no DTC for this but worth checking)
So the recommendation by finall to put everything back as it was, looks to be thebest courseof action.
Perhaps the LED's are drawing too much current and crippling the lamp voltage?
Note the rear door courtesy lamps are handled differently !
- Oceanbrave, Thanks for the info. Just wondering if you know if the power supply for the front two doors is routed through the drivers door... just trying to settle the idea in my head that has we curious :-)
as for the courtesy lamp circuit, where would that be. I see you have referred to specific location or fuse/ links/ connection, but I am not sure what or where they are at? I havent seen anything in the manual stating the locations or anything else really to mark these parts like you mentioned.
I read you stated the DTC, I assume you are referring to the OBD port/ plug to the left lower section to the dash, just under the dash just above the parking brake?
As for what was done, it wasnt LEDs. I removed the panels to fix any cracks, broken connectors to hold the door panel to the metal door part, and whatever else that the doors were showing. As for the LEDs, again didnt do that, but again my curiosity is such that I want to learn.... i thought LED lights were always lower volts/watts/amps/ and etc...? (am I wrong?)
Originally Posted by oceanbrave
BTW If you have a meter, take one of your old lamps, connect 12V and measure the current, your LEDS should certainly consume no more, but it would be interesting to know what the value is.
I've looked online, but apart from one eBay Chinese supplier who lists 3Watts, I can find not wattage figure for GM 15021517.
However the chip that drives it is a BTS716 has maximum power dissipation is 3.6W, taking 12.5V at 3W this translates to approx 0.25A, not that much really (Chinese could be right)
It's unlikely that an open-circuit courtesy lamp would cause the DDM to malfunction, so the LEDS maybe drawing draw too much.
Just a theory at the moment.
- what is GM 15021517? I mean I understand it is a part number for the hummer, but what is it so i know what i might be testing.
also, I am not sure what you mean about this statement "However the chip that drives it is a BTS716 has maximum power dissipation is 3.6W, taking 12.5V at 3W this translates to approx 0.25A, not that much really (Chinese could be right)"... especially the chinese could be right statement?
Originally Posted by finall
@oceanbrave
He has not actually admitted to the reason why he pulled off the door panels. I was just guessing that it was for LEDs. The typical reason for someone to pull all door panels.
So not sure this has anything to do with LEDs. We need OP to pipe up!
I have seen LEDs cause circuit problems before on this and car forums. Especially the untested Chinese crap. Hence my suspicion.
- nope no big embarassing secret or some kind of cover up. I have just been really busy and it is hard for me to jump on the computer... so I havent had a chance yet. Heck, yesterday, I wanted to get back into the door like Hummerz and Ocean have suggested, but I havent had the time.
Originally Posted by oceanbrave
finall
Odds are good something has affected both DDM and PDM in a similar fashion.
Let's see what the outcome is...
- Oceanbrave, where would the PDM fuse be, I know wheere the DDM fuse is at, checked it, its intact, looks like there is a slightly blackish/ grayish on the two prongs. it isnt really that bad. and the arch made inside the actual plastic piece of the fuse is still intact and doesnt show any blackish/ greyish color. Just a nice silver color :-)
Originally Posted by hummerz
Inspect connectors you took apart for broken pins.
Again if the mirrors are working there has to be power on the DDM and PDM, also the front doors are wired independently with separate fuses with the left and right Door Lock Actuators powered directly by the DDM and PDM respectively.
Re Power To Front Doors
The actual physical door wiring i.e. how it routes from the fuse block to connector DDM C2, I have no details for, however here is one sketch the DDM (there are many) :-
You can see the power wires start from the Fuse Block and go to connector C2 (both DDM + PDM) I assume directly.
The DDM and PDM Fuses are located as below:-
The panel unclips starting at the bottom of the panel, on the back side is printed the fuse locations as below:-
Note the above are correct, I've just checked by unplugging my PDM fuse.
Re Courtesy Lamps
Again for the front doors these are driven directly by the DDM and PDM. Here is the DDM wiring (PDM is similar)
Re DTC
Usually with a malfunction there's a Check Engine Light and an associated Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) these can be read by a scan-tool on the OBD2 port (located as you mentioned)
For example Googling GM Door Lamps, DTC B2615, B2555 + others popped-up I checked this on a 2005 and 2009 and it looks like the later years have more codes..
Re GM 15021517
This is the P/No for a genuine GM Courtesy Lamp Module but as you say it can't be that (unless the wires have somehow got trapped and shorted)
Re Chip BTS716
The DDM (and PDM) is a Microprocessor based system and this IC handles the Courtesy Lamp drive. If the chip was overloaded it could cause the door module to malfunction (theoretically) so I mentioned this as one possible explanation as to why the DDM has power, but no other activity other than the mirrors.
As I mentioned there was a Chinese Ad on eBay quoting 3W as the Courtesy Lamp power rating, as this matched the chips maximum drive capability so I said the "Chinese could be right" as no other lamp suppliers quoted the power rating.
You are right LEDs could be lower power but as both of your Door Modules are not working it was logical to assume a common factor, and over-current Courtesy Lamp scenario could have been that. The DDM directly monitors the output voltage of the Courtesy Lights, but it is unclear what action it takes in the event of an overload or what DTC is set if any.
(BTW if you change your stop light bulbs to LEDs you'll find the cruise control stops working)
Maybe as @hummerz and @bronxteck suggest there is a broken pin or wire, or trapped wire, however I've just completely disconnected my DDM and the passenger side still functions without it i.e. windows and locks. It's also not possible to get the DDM connectors swapped over i.e. the two 10 ways (blue & black) however if C2 is not seated correctly using it's latching arm the module will be inert but so to the mirrors! You can pretty much unplug C3, C4 and C5 and the DDM will still work, except for the function of those particular plugs of course, it's pretty resilient.
Trying to help out with possibilities, I personally have studied the earlier DDM's in detail and reversed engineered all the microprocessor circuitry, pcb design, every component, every track, every pin, LED switch and function, so I am quite familiar. For the PDM I have also done a little bit or work, which is why I asked if the key fob works because the receiver is in this module.
What ever has happened is catastrophic, but the fact that the mirrors work is curious. I say this because all the switches and LEDs are handled by a separate Keypad-PCB that plugs into the main DDM PCB, the switches form part of the same data-stream, so it's odd for one switch to work but not others.
There are 6 panel LEDS controlled in 3 groups, 1 for the 4-Way Pad, 1 for the Windows-Lock and 4 General Lighting, these are controlled directly by the Microprocessor CPU. There are two main reasons why these are not working:-
There is no 12V but then the mirrors wouldn't work either since they derived the power from the DDM 12V supply.
The CPU is deliberately not energising them, same goes for the Courtesy Lights (Red and Whites) which could happen if the CPU goes into some kind of fault mode.
Missing or loose grounds issues can also produce strange results.
If any liquids have contaminated the PCBs then strange things could happen, but again it's odd that it affects both doors.
Clearly something has been done or missed that has affected operations. Perhaps one door module can affect the other so you could try unplugging one side and then the other to see what happens.
Also what model year is your Hummer?
Ah I see it is an 03
Last edited by oceanbrave; 05-07-2022 at 05:14 AM.
Well I found the issue.
With all this mess, I noticed today that the overhead lights were really dim and the front oem fogs werent working. Didnt understand why so I thought my battery was going dead since I had been working on this for while.
I put the charger on the battery and pulled the doors apart. I found no issues. Everything was connected as it should be and the pins were all perfect. So then I thought about the OBD, so I plugged in my Autel... just as I did, the lights in the truck got bright again. Weird.
I also checked my fogs and they were working again.
I ran diagnostics and it shows codes for the issues I am having. So I have a short, and I know where it is at now.... behind the light switch.
Weird that plugging in my OBD reader instantly corrected the problem... and i didnt even need to do anything. Maybe you might know why OceanBrave?
Thanks all
Well I found the issue.
With all this mess, I noticed today that the overhead lights were really dim and the front oem fogs werent working. Didnt understand why so I thought my battery was going dead since I had been working on this for while.
I put the charger on the battery and pulled the doors apart. I found no issues. Everything was connected as it should be and the pins were all perfect. So then I thought about the OBD, so I plugged in my Autel... just as I did, the lights in the truck got bright again. Weird.
I also checked my fogs and they were working again.
I ran diagnostics and it shows codes for the issues I am having. So I have a short, and I know where it is at now.... behind the light switch.
Weird that plugging in my OBD reader instantly corrected the problem... and i didnt even need to do anything. Maybe you might know why OceanBrave?
Thanks all
You're right that does sound a little weird, can't imagine why introducing the additional node of the Autel should change anything unless:-
There's flaky module on the serial-comms bus that suddenly changed state, perhaps with the battery being charged.
Or there was something bridging in the ODB2 connector that cleared when you plugged in the Autel.
Possibly something loose floating around inside a door module that moved when the doors were pulled apart? (easy to disassemble door modules)
Thing is, serial-comms affects virtually every module in the truck, I would have expected more problems not just the door modules.
Guess you may never know until you're 500 miles from anywhere, off-roading over the Rockies being pursued by a Grizzly.
Do you know what the components are that are shorting?
Also could you list the Aute's code(s) they would be most helpful?
(DTC's are everything)
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are you connecting the obd connector by itself or are you also adding a cigaret lighter adapter. if using the cigarett adapter in conjunction with the obd then the scanner can feed the obd power rails from it bypassing bad ground or power.
are you connecting the obd connector by itself or are you also adding a cigaret lighter adapter. if using the cigarett adapter in conjunction with the obd then the scanner can feed the obd power rails from it bypassing bad ground or power.
The readers are both powered by their own batteries (the full Autel system is cordless in both the reader and the OBD attachment, and my cell phone which is using Torque and Carista with the ELM327 which is bluetooth and gets power from the OBD port.
So nothing is plugged into the cigarette lighter or anything else. The only thing plugged in is the sending units
The fact that the OBD plug ins actually make whatever is going on bad, suddenly turn good is a mystery to me. I believe it is a short, pinched wire, behind the actual light switch for the main headlights. No blown fuses or anything. Which that is weird since you would think that a short would possible cause the fuse to go, but i think it is an issue with over grounding. The power might be getting ground out, so there isnt a surge or anything to cause the fuses to blow but at the same time allowing some current to pass which allows the interior lights to glow at a low level... but like i said, the weird part is how when the ELM327 is plugged in, the interior lights immediately glow at normal light.
05-05-2022, 05:12 PM
