08 Alpha Fuel Issue
#1
04-27-2014, 01:52 PM
08 Alpha Fuel Issue
So I just bought an 08 Alpha the day before yesterday. Its got about 90k miles. I had to drive to San Antonio from Dallas to pick it up and it made the drive home safe and sound with no hickups. It even started up and ran just fine the morning after when I was checking the fluids and everything.
Later in the day I drove to an NTB to get the tires balanced(lifted on 35s) and when the guys go out to start it, it wont crank. We check everything out and couldn't see anything obvious so they crawl under and start banging on the tank which gets it farther in the starting process. I wont say it got it to slmost start but the noises were better maybe. They offer to push it into the bay and diagnose it, for a discounted fee of course. Its throwing no codes and the pump makes noise like its running but when they disconnected a fuel line, its not pushing any fuel. I pulled and checked the fuses and relay under hood and they all seem fine.
The thing is that the previous owner said he just replaced the fuel pump and that couldn't be the problem. Hes saying he thinks its the ignition or something. I just spent a ton of money on this thing and don't want to spend another 1000 for a fuel pump when its apparently got a new one.
Any ideas on this? Could it be the fuel pump control module or something else?
I know this thing has been offroaded some and it wouldn't surprise me if its been under water crossing a river or something.
Later in the day I drove to an NTB to get the tires balanced(lifted on 35s) and when the guys go out to start it, it wont crank. We check everything out and couldn't see anything obvious so they crawl under and start banging on the tank which gets it farther in the starting process. I wont say it got it to slmost start but the noises were better maybe. They offer to push it into the bay and diagnose it, for a discounted fee of course. Its throwing no codes and the pump makes noise like its running but when they disconnected a fuel line, its not pushing any fuel. I pulled and checked the fuses and relay under hood and they all seem fine.
The thing is that the previous owner said he just replaced the fuel pump and that couldn't be the problem. Hes saying he thinks its the ignition or something. I just spent a ton of money on this thing and don't want to spend another 1000 for a fuel pump when its apparently got a new one.
Any ideas on this? Could it be the fuel pump control module or something else?
I know this thing has been offroaded some and it wouldn't surprise me if its been under water crossing a river or something.
#4
04-27-2014, 07:23 PM
Or at least, that's what the kids at NTB said. All I know is that you can hear the fuel pump but it wont actually start and theres supposedly no fuel coming through.
#6
04-28-2014, 10:29 AM
I looked into that and tried the reset. I'm not getting the security dash light though. Could it still be the passlock without that?
Truck still won't start. I thought the passlock reset itself after 10 minutes?
Truck still won't start. I thought the passlock reset itself after 10 minutes?
#7
04-28-2014, 12:33 PM
If the light is not flashing then you likely have another issue. I would go back to the fuel pump. Just because it was just replaced doesn't mean it is not the problem. He may have had the same issues as you before the replacement and it temporarily fixed a pre-existing problem.
#8
04-28-2014, 06:09 PM
Diagnostic System Check - Vehicle
Before beginning vehicle diagnosis, the following preliminary inspections/tests must be performed:
Ensure that the battery is fully charged. Refer to Battery Inspection/Test.
Ensure that the battery cables are clean and tight.
Inspect for any open fuses. Refer to Power Distribution Schematics and Electrical Center Identification Views.
Ensure that the grounds are clean, tight, and in the correct location. Refer to Ground Distribution Schematics and Harness Routing Views.
Inspect the easily accessible systems or the visible system components for obvious damage or conditions that could cause the concern. This would include checking to ensure that all connections/connectors are fully seated and secured.
Inspect for aftermarket devices that could affect the operation of the system. Refer to Checking Aftermarket Accessories.
Search for applicable service bulletins.
⇒X If the preceding inspections/tests resolve the concern, go to Diagnostic Repair Verification.
Install a scan tool. Verify that the scan tool powers up.
⇒X If the scan tool does not power up, refer to Scan Tool Does Not Power Up.
Ignition ON, Engine OFF, verify communication with all of the control modules on the vehicle. Refer to Data Link References for information on the modules you should expect to communicate.
⇒X If the scan tool does not communicate with one or more of the expected control modules, refer to Data Link References.
Important: Open the drivers door to ensure retained accessory power mode (RAP) is inactive during this test. The engine may start during this test. Turn the engine OFF as soon as the crank power mode has been observed.
Access the Power Mode parameter on the scan tool. Verify the power mode parameter matches all the ignition switch positions. Refer to Power Mode Description and Operation for information on the power mode states that correspond to each ignition switch position.
⇒X If the power mode parameter does not match the ignition switch position for all ignition switch positions, refer to Power Mode Mismatch.
Ignition ON, view the security indicator. The security indicator should not remain illuminated after the vehicle bulb check has completed.
⇒X If the security indicator remains illuminated after the bulb check, refer to Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) List - Vehicleand diagnose any of the following theft deterrent DTCs set as current: B1000, B302A, B3031, B3055, B3060, B3935, B3976, P0513, P0633, P1629, P1631, or P1632.
Attempt to start the engine. Verify that the engine cranks.
⇒X If the engine does not crank, refer to Symptoms - Engine Electrical.
Attempt to start the engine. Verify the engine starts and idles.
⇒X If the engine does not start and idle, refer to Engine Cranks But Does Not Runfor the 3.7L engine or Engine Cranks But Does Not Runfor the 5.3L engine.
Important: Do not clear any DTCs unless instructed to do so by a diagnostic procedure.
Important: If any DTCs are Powertrain related DTCs, select Capture Info in order to store the DTC information with the scan tool.
Use the appropriate scan tool selections to obtain DTCs from each of the vehicle modules. Verify there are no DTCs reported from any module.
⇒X If any DTCs are present, refer to Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) List - Vehicleand diagnose any current DTCs in the following order:
7.1. DTCs that begin with a U.
7.2. Any of the following: B1000, B1001, B1004, B1007, B1009, C0550, P0601, P0602, P0603, P0604, P0606, P0607, P060D, P062F, or P2610.
7.3. Any of the following: B1327, B1372, B1373, B1390, B1442, B1443, C0899, P0562, or P0563.
7.4. Component level DTCs.
7.5. System level DTCs.
7.6. Any remaining DTCs.
Engine Cranks But Does Not Run
Diagnostic Instructions
Perform the Diagnostic System Check - Vehicle prior to using this diagnostic procedure.
Review Strategy Based Diagnosis for an overview of the diagnostic approach.
Diagnostic Procedure Instructions provides an overview of each diagnostic category.
Circuit/System Description
This Engine Cranks but Does Not Run diagnostic is an organized approach to identify a condition which causes the engine to crank but does not continue to run. This diagnostic directs the service technician to the appropriate system diagnosis. This diagnostic assumes the vehicle system voltage levels are adequate for starter motor operation. Refer to Battery Inspection/Test and Engine Cranks Slowly. The fuel level supply must be adequate, and the fuel quality must be able to sustain the combustion process.
Diagnostic Aids
When disconnecting electrical connectors or removing fuses and relays from a fuse block, always inspect both mating electrical terminals for corrosion and terminal tightness.
Use the J 35616 Connector Test Adapter Kit for any test that requires probing the underhood fuse block terminals, component wire harness terminals, or the ECM wire harness terminals.
Reference Information
Schematic Reference
Engine Controls Schematics
Connector End View Reference
Component Connector End Views
Electrical Information Reference
Circuit Testing
Connector Repairs
Testing for Intermittent Conditions and Poor Connections
Wiring Repairs
DTC Type Reference
Powertrain Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) Type Definitions
Scan Tool Reference
Control Module References for scan tool information
Special Tools
J 34730-1A Fuel Pressure Gage
J 35616-A/BT-8637 Connector Test Adapter Kit
J 43244 Relay Puller Pliers
Circuit/System Verification
Attempt to start the engine. The engine should start and run.
⇒X If the vehicle passes the Circuit/System Verification test, refer to Testing for Intermittent Conditions and Poor Connections.
Circuit/System Testing
Crank the engine for 15 seconds.
Observe the vehicle DTC information with a scan tool.
⇒X If any DTCs are set, repair those DTCs first. Refer to Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) List - Vehicle.
With the ignition ON and the engine OFF, test the fuses that are supplied ignition 1 voltage by the powertrain relay. The test lamp should illuminate ON for each test point of the fuses.
⇒X If the test lamp does not illuminate ON for at least one test point of each fuse, refer to DTC P0685 or P0690.
Crank the engine for 15 seconds. Observe the engine speed parameter with a scan tool.
⇒X If engine RPM is not indicated, refer to DTC P0335.
Install a spark plug tester onto one ignition module/coil assembly on each bank of the engine.
Observe both spark plug testers.
Important: An erratic or weak spark is considered a no spark condition.
Crank the engine for 15 seconds. The ignition coil secondary voltage should be observed across the gap of both spark plug testers.
⇒X If the ignition coil secondary voltage is not observed, is inconsistent, or weak on either spark plug tester, refer to Electronic Ignition System Diagnosis.
With the ignition ON and the engine OFF, command the fuel pump ON and OFF with the scan tool. The fuel pump should energize when commanded ON, and de-energize when commanded OFF.
⇒X If the fuel pump does not turn ON and OFF, refer to Fuel Pump Electrical Circuit Diagnosis.
Turn OFF the ignition.
Install the J 34730-1A Fuel Pressure Gage. With the ignition ON and the engine OFF, command the fuel pump ON several times with the scan tool. Refer to Fuel System Diagnosis for the fuel pressure specification.
Inspect for the following conditions:
Compare the actual engine coolant temperature to the ECT parameter.
Filter and air intake system for restrictions and obstructions
Test the fuel for contamination—Refer to Alcohol/Contaminants-in-Fuel Diagnosis.
Inspect the spark plugs—Refer to Spark Plug Inspection.
Test the exhaust system for restrictions—Refer to Restricted Exhaust.
Engine mechanical conditions, such as worn timing chain, sprocket gears, low compression, etc.—Refer to Symptoms - Engine Mechanical.
Repair Instructions
Perform the Diagnostic Repair Verification after completing the diagnostic procedure.
Before beginning vehicle diagnosis, the following preliminary inspections/tests must be performed:
Ensure that the battery is fully charged. Refer to Battery Inspection/Test.
Ensure that the battery cables are clean and tight.
Inspect for any open fuses. Refer to Power Distribution Schematics and Electrical Center Identification Views.
Ensure that the grounds are clean, tight, and in the correct location. Refer to Ground Distribution Schematics and Harness Routing Views.
Inspect the easily accessible systems or the visible system components for obvious damage or conditions that could cause the concern. This would include checking to ensure that all connections/connectors are fully seated and secured.
Inspect for aftermarket devices that could affect the operation of the system. Refer to Checking Aftermarket Accessories.
Search for applicable service bulletins.
⇒X If the preceding inspections/tests resolve the concern, go to Diagnostic Repair Verification.
Install a scan tool. Verify that the scan tool powers up.
⇒X If the scan tool does not power up, refer to Scan Tool Does Not Power Up.
Ignition ON, Engine OFF, verify communication with all of the control modules on the vehicle. Refer to Data Link References for information on the modules you should expect to communicate.
⇒X If the scan tool does not communicate with one or more of the expected control modules, refer to Data Link References.
Important: Open the drivers door to ensure retained accessory power mode (RAP) is inactive during this test. The engine may start during this test. Turn the engine OFF as soon as the crank power mode has been observed.
Access the Power Mode parameter on the scan tool. Verify the power mode parameter matches all the ignition switch positions. Refer to Power Mode Description and Operation for information on the power mode states that correspond to each ignition switch position.
⇒X If the power mode parameter does not match the ignition switch position for all ignition switch positions, refer to Power Mode Mismatch.
Ignition ON, view the security indicator. The security indicator should not remain illuminated after the vehicle bulb check has completed.
⇒X If the security indicator remains illuminated after the bulb check, refer to Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) List - Vehicleand diagnose any of the following theft deterrent DTCs set as current: B1000, B302A, B3031, B3055, B3060, B3935, B3976, P0513, P0633, P1629, P1631, or P1632.
Attempt to start the engine. Verify that the engine cranks.
⇒X If the engine does not crank, refer to Symptoms - Engine Electrical.
Attempt to start the engine. Verify the engine starts and idles.
⇒X If the engine does not start and idle, refer to Engine Cranks But Does Not Runfor the 3.7L engine or Engine Cranks But Does Not Runfor the 5.3L engine.
Important: Do not clear any DTCs unless instructed to do so by a diagnostic procedure.
Important: If any DTCs are Powertrain related DTCs, select Capture Info in order to store the DTC information with the scan tool.
Use the appropriate scan tool selections to obtain DTCs from each of the vehicle modules. Verify there are no DTCs reported from any module.
⇒X If any DTCs are present, refer to Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) List - Vehicleand diagnose any current DTCs in the following order:
7.1. DTCs that begin with a U.
7.2. Any of the following: B1000, B1001, B1004, B1007, B1009, C0550, P0601, P0602, P0603, P0604, P0606, P0607, P060D, P062F, or P2610.
7.3. Any of the following: B1327, B1372, B1373, B1390, B1442, B1443, C0899, P0562, or P0563.
7.4. Component level DTCs.
7.5. System level DTCs.
7.6. Any remaining DTCs.
Engine Cranks But Does Not Run
Diagnostic Instructions
Perform the Diagnostic System Check - Vehicle prior to using this diagnostic procedure.
Review Strategy Based Diagnosis for an overview of the diagnostic approach.
Diagnostic Procedure Instructions provides an overview of each diagnostic category.
Circuit/System Description
This Engine Cranks but Does Not Run diagnostic is an organized approach to identify a condition which causes the engine to crank but does not continue to run. This diagnostic directs the service technician to the appropriate system diagnosis. This diagnostic assumes the vehicle system voltage levels are adequate for starter motor operation. Refer to Battery Inspection/Test and Engine Cranks Slowly. The fuel level supply must be adequate, and the fuel quality must be able to sustain the combustion process.
Diagnostic Aids
When disconnecting electrical connectors or removing fuses and relays from a fuse block, always inspect both mating electrical terminals for corrosion and terminal tightness.
Use the J 35616 Connector Test Adapter Kit for any test that requires probing the underhood fuse block terminals, component wire harness terminals, or the ECM wire harness terminals.
Reference Information
Schematic Reference
Engine Controls Schematics
Connector End View Reference
Component Connector End Views
Electrical Information Reference
Circuit Testing
Connector Repairs
Testing for Intermittent Conditions and Poor Connections
Wiring Repairs
DTC Type Reference
Powertrain Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) Type Definitions
Scan Tool Reference
Control Module References for scan tool information
Special Tools
J 34730-1A Fuel Pressure Gage
J 35616-A/BT-8637 Connector Test Adapter Kit
J 43244 Relay Puller Pliers
Circuit/System Verification
Attempt to start the engine. The engine should start and run.
⇒X If the vehicle passes the Circuit/System Verification test, refer to Testing for Intermittent Conditions and Poor Connections.
Circuit/System Testing
Crank the engine for 15 seconds.
Observe the vehicle DTC information with a scan tool.
⇒X If any DTCs are set, repair those DTCs first. Refer to Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) List - Vehicle.
With the ignition ON and the engine OFF, test the fuses that are supplied ignition 1 voltage by the powertrain relay. The test lamp should illuminate ON for each test point of the fuses.
⇒X If the test lamp does not illuminate ON for at least one test point of each fuse, refer to DTC P0685 or P0690.
Crank the engine for 15 seconds. Observe the engine speed parameter with a scan tool.
⇒X If engine RPM is not indicated, refer to DTC P0335.
Install a spark plug tester onto one ignition module/coil assembly on each bank of the engine.
Observe both spark plug testers.
Important: An erratic or weak spark is considered a no spark condition.
Crank the engine for 15 seconds. The ignition coil secondary voltage should be observed across the gap of both spark plug testers.
⇒X If the ignition coil secondary voltage is not observed, is inconsistent, or weak on either spark plug tester, refer to Electronic Ignition System Diagnosis.
With the ignition ON and the engine OFF, command the fuel pump ON and OFF with the scan tool. The fuel pump should energize when commanded ON, and de-energize when commanded OFF.
⇒X If the fuel pump does not turn ON and OFF, refer to Fuel Pump Electrical Circuit Diagnosis.
Turn OFF the ignition.
Install the J 34730-1A Fuel Pressure Gage. With the ignition ON and the engine OFF, command the fuel pump ON several times with the scan tool. Refer to Fuel System Diagnosis for the fuel pressure specification.
Inspect for the following conditions:
Compare the actual engine coolant temperature to the ECT parameter.
Filter and air intake system for restrictions and obstructions
Test the fuel for contamination—Refer to Alcohol/Contaminants-in-Fuel Diagnosis.
Inspect the spark plugs—Refer to Spark Plug Inspection.
Test the exhaust system for restrictions—Refer to Restricted Exhaust.
Engine mechanical conditions, such as worn timing chain, sprocket gears, low compression, etc.—Refer to Symptoms - Engine Mechanical.
Repair Instructions
Perform the Diagnostic Repair Verification after completing the diagnostic procedure.
#9
04-29-2014, 08:56 PM
Oh wow. I'll have to pass that on to the mechanic that it seems I will inevitably take the truck to.
I did retry the passlock deactivation. This time I might have done it a little more correctly since it almost fired up. Before, the engine wouldn't fire up enough to hear anything from the exhaust but this time it actually got that far. Only for a second, but that's enough progress to make me think it might be a faulty ignition module or complete passlock failure. The previous owner has been saying he thinks its the ignition and I actually believe him this time. Im not sure why the passlock reset isn't working though.
I did retry the passlock deactivation. This time I might have done it a little more correctly since it almost fired up. Before, the engine wouldn't fire up enough to hear anything from the exhaust but this time it actually got that far. Only for a second, but that's enough progress to make me think it might be a faulty ignition module or complete passlock failure. The previous owner has been saying he thinks its the ignition and I actually believe him this time. Im not sure why the passlock reset isn't working though.