RE: difference betwen stock filter & K&N filter
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RE: difference betwen stock filter & K&N filter - 7/24/2007 1:00:08 PM
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HummerGuy
Posts: 6684
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Allow me to clarify a few things gentlemen  (you know this post will be a book) lol
First off, I did not know they had MAF (not MAP) cleaner. I'm going to Advance Auto Parts tonight anyway, so I'll look for it. I've used the CRC stuff in the past, and it's usually the best for the money. I do like it, but now that I know they make specific MAF cleaner, I will definitely pick a can up tonight.
Secondly, the H3 (I just learned this 2 days ago) has a MAF and a MAP. MAF is the obvious, but there is a MAP, which is Mass Air Pressure sensor. I just had this replaced today/yesterday. I looked the GM code P0106 up on the net, in addition to my OBDII scanner coming back with a MAP sensor error. What I found on numerous sites is that the MAP sensor measure barometric pressure. Apparently this went bad in my H3 last week. I don't know if that's pressure within the engine, or a vacuum line, etc, because I'm not that knowledgeable engines in general. I know how internal combustion works, but I don't know about vacuum hoses and how much psi goes into a cylinder, etc. All I know is the I-5 has one, and mine went bad I just thought I'd share for all you gearheads out there. Now, why you would need to know barametric pressure outside of the engine is beyond me, so I'm assuming it's internal somehow.
The MAF on the other hand (Mass Air Flow sensor) on all 5 of the cars I have bought NEW K&N filters on, has had the oil build-up problem on the resistors, fresh out of the box before any re-oiling ever happened. Now, that's just a really STRANGE co-incidence, or it's something most people don't notice. Since all of you are into engines more-so then I, I am believing that it's just been a coincidence more then "the way it is." I've had one on my '95 Camaro 3.4L, '99 Isuzu Rodeo LS V6, '03 VW Turbo, '93 Honda CBR 600 sportbike, and my now '06 Hummer H3. Every one of those vehicles had them brand new out of the box, and after about 6 months, had oil build up on the MAF. I learned the hard way from the Rodeo when I first cleaned it, then knew to watch for it ever since. The build-up was so bad the engine would barely run anymore. Once I cleaned it and reset the computer, it ran like new. On my CBR, I had oil residue inside the air filter compartment and on the carb valves, but that could have just been from the engine. I'm not saying it's supposed to be like that, but it's just been my experience that it's happened. The only filter I have ever re-oiled was the H3, and I was very careful to not overdue it because of this. I was even tempted to run it dry, but knew that wouldn't be such a smart idea.
So, anyway, I just wanted to clarify my supposed bad luck with these things and the oil evaporating. Once in a while I take off my intake hoses and clean those with a rag and blow out the dust and dirt. So far, there hasn't been much in there. It's been very clean. I know there is some new high-performance dry filter out there that is supposed to be better and allow more air then K&N, but I don't remember the name. I do remember almost buying it though. The bad thing they were around $45 to $50 and had to be replaced rather then re-charged, but lasted a long time.
< Message edited by HummerGuy -- 7/24/2007 1:07:05 PM >
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RE: difference betwen stock filter & K&N filter - 7/24/2007 2:16:58 PM
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Doc Olds
Posts: 3787
Joined: 7/11/2007
From: Boat Town USA (Michigan 48045)
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You want to know the common Joe difference. The MAP is sensing air flow, VOLUME, from differnet locations depending on which model auto you are talking about (disclaimer: I am a GM guy.....everything else is foreign) of the manifold intake pressure on a FUEL INJECTED engine. Like a high efficiency furnace pressure sensor. To control fuel mixture.
The MAF is sending tempurature data to the truck's computer in order to maintain proper ignition timing. When hot and muggy, it retards the timing to douse performance/power. Power makes heat. This too cross references the volume of air because cool air is more dense. This ain't rocket science.  When you play with the reading of the two you can effect performance......(chips and PCMs) but the MAF is less critical than the MAP.
In closing..........if your damn MAP or MAF are dirty from whatever...... .....clean em! I'm still skeptical that the air filter oil is a major culprit. This is all from a guy that tunes 35-40 year old Oldsmobiles. LOL
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RE: difference betwen stock filter & K&N filter - 7/24/2007 2:29:39 PM
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mfish
Posts: 382
Joined: 4/9/2007
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From K&N:
Over-oiling
When servicing a K&N filter, take care not to over-oil the element. Besides impeding air flow, excess oil can migrate into the intake system where it can coat electronic sensors, which some OEM’s claim may hinder the sensors’ operation and result in a repair that will not be covered under warranty. Although K&N disagrees with such claims, as explained in more detail on this web site, in order to avoid a dispute with an OEM over the denial of a warranty claim, we suggest that you be careful not to over-oil your K&N air filter. Never saturate the filter. If oil drips from the filter, wash it and start over. Use only K&N oil. For example, an E-1500 filter has 92.4-inches of surface area requiring 1.707 fluid ounces of oil. Follow oiling instructions included with your filter or refer to the instructions listed here
_____________________________
06 H3; adventure & lux package; Gibson catback; readylift leveling kit; and some other stuff...
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RE: difference betwen stock filter & K&N filter - 7/24/2007 6:31:15 PM
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Doc Olds
Posts: 3787
Joined: 7/11/2007
From: Boat Town USA (Michigan 48045)
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Beautiful, absolutely beautiful! I second the conclusion reached by our fearless administrator.
I did two things after work today. Stopped by the Murray's Auto and just looked at a K&N in a box off the shelf. It did seem to have a little extra oil on the flat rubber end and mounting circle. Nothing major, but maybe worth wiping off b4 installing. I didn't remember mine being a little extra oily when I bought it, but I wasn't scrutinizing then.
When I got home after doing the wifey list, I pulled my filter out and also looked at the sensor in the intake pipe. Dennis, I have to say, mine is darn near as beautifully clean and pristine as yours. Per the info from K&N, thanks mfish, I will be a careful filter oiler from now on. Filter oiler anonymous chapter starting soon.
Hello Brandon07, thanks for starting this thread of overkill on the air filter and the issue of oil, but not to over oil. It is amazing how much info the members here can amass on any given topic. Great forum all.
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RE: difference betwen stock filter & K&N filter - 7/25/2007 4:48:59 AM
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HummerGuy
Posts: 6684
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Dennis
Conclusion: YOU ARE OVER OILING YOUR FILTERS!!!
OK Dennis. I'm going to say this ONE MORE TIME, and then I'm going to come to OK and put finger prints ALL over your H3
Please, read the following CAREFULLY "The MAF on the other hand (Mass Air Flow sensor) on all 5 of the cars I have bought NEW K&N filters on, has had the oil build-up problem on the resistors, fresh out of the box before any re-oiling ever happened."
I hope this clarifies some things for you as you always like to bring to my attention my lack reading skills sometimes........ touche (if that's even spelled right )
So, let's just ALL agree that I have just had BAD luck with the filters being over-oiled right from the factory. Can we please say this would be the LOGICAL conclusion here? PLEASE?
And Doc, THANKS for clarifying  . As I said, I never heard of a MAP until the past week. I'll tell you what though, I'm getting awsome mileage now that there is a new one in there. I got to work today and at 1/4 tank I was at 120 miles on the Odometer. Pretty damn good compared to before.
< Message edited by HummerGuy -- 7/25/2007 4:50:54 AM >
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RE: difference betwen stock filter & K&N filter - 7/25/2007 5:39:49 AM
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HummerGuy
Posts: 6684
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Dennis: Don't you think it would be hard for me to add oil WHEN I DIDN'T HAVE ANY!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
The first one I ever re-oiled was his H3 one, and I actually hardly put any on there because I knew what would happen. Thank you for your sincere confidence in my ability to be honest. It's most riteous and noble of you
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RE: difference betwen stock filter & K&N filter - 7/25/2007 6:13:04 AM
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D VADER
Posts: 1191
Joined: 5/21/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Brandon07
 Thanks for all the information from Dennis, Dvader and others.
So the conclution is that using a K&N filter will increase the HP by maybe 4 or 5 horses at the most. What about using a CAI system without installing the free flowing muffler or cat back system, . I drive a Avalanche 1500 with a K&N force induction system and free flowing muffler, the wife does not like the noise.
So the question is how much improvement verses the loudness of intake. Thanks in advance.
My experience has been the CAI is only moderately noisey at full throttle. I'm concerned about exhaust noise two. I added a Corsa to my last car and IMO it was rather noisey.
_____________________________
2007 H3X w/lux pkg, black on black, Starship from the "Dark Side"
Central Ohio
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RE: difference betwen stock filter & K&N filter - 7/25/2007 6:15:40 AM
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HummerGuy
Posts: 6684
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Dennis
You know of course..I'm just messing with you...right?
Of course I do
dik
< Message edited by HummerGuy -- 7/25/2007 6:18:06 AM >
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